The Legal Drug Dealer Podcast

Getting Pharmacy as a profession Closer to The Patient

April 14, 2020

#18 Ditch Bladder Pain

With Lisa King, RPh & Marilena Grittani, RPh

This is a subject that affects a lot of women out there and most of them don’t even know it is their bladders.

So, in this episode, Lisa King, RPh, explained to us in such an easy way to understand, and her passion for it is  noticeable, not only because she is an expert on it, but because she went through it!

Among other topics we talked about:

  • Foods that irritate your bladder
  • Mindset is a crucial aspect of improving your bladder health.
  • How having a community that talks about the same subject is so important to help you through it.
  • How hard is to get diagnoses and what specific doctors you need to see to get the help you need.
  • How bad this pain could be and how it could affect your daily life.
  • How family members (spouses) could support the patient that is going through this painful issue.

"About 3 to 8 million women in the US have Interstitial Cystitis, however; there are an additional 30 million women over the age of 40 with an overactive bladder. That’s an incredible amount of women with bladder issues suffering in silence.."

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Listen To The Episode Here

If you think that you or someone you know can benefit from the information shared in this episode, please share it with them. 

And don’t forget that, if you are subscribed to our mailing list, you got the informational sheet that Lisa King, RPh prepared for you. On this occasion it is about Ditching Bladder pain 

As an attachment to our weekly email, but if you are not subscribed, make sure you subscribe to it, and you will get immediate access to it, and you will be up-to-date for future episodes.

Lisa is very straight forward and clear on her delivery. 

She, also, knows becasue she went through it!!!

Let me know what you think about our conversation and if you have any questions!!!


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Thank you!

"If you have overactive I mean you pee too much. If you have pain,
excruciating pain when you pee and you don't feel that that is being resolved by an antibiotic
because it's not an infection, then you might suspect on IC "

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Episode Transcripts

Marilena Grittani, RPh 0:08
Hola! Welcome to the Legal Drug Dealer podcast.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 0:11
Marilena Grittani here, I’m a registered pharmacist and also your host, thank you so much for listening to this new episode number 18. The name of this episode is ditch bladder pain. My guest this time is another pharmacist colleague of mine that is an expert in this area, and she has a very personal relationship with it. Her name is Lisa King. She actually is my neighbor. She lives here in Scottsdale as well. And she’s been a pharmacist for over 32 years. I think you’re going to get a lot of information that is important for you. I think you’re going to clarify a lot of questions that you might have. And this is going to open your eyes and your ears and your mind to other stuff that might be happening that you never consider that was coming from this. Hopefully you We’ll get a good information about this and it’s going to help you on your bladder health. Well, that’s it. Let’s just start. Lisa, welcome to The Legal drug dealer podcast is so I’m so happy to have you here. Finally we did it.

Lisa King, RPh 1:12
Yes. I’m so excited to be here. I’m thrilled to be talking with you today.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:17
Well, Lisa is not only my colleague, but also my neighbor. Unfortunately, we cannot be together because of my surgery. I cannot move but next time we need to do it live.

Lisa King, RPh 1:28
Yes, only a friend of having a cup of coffee with you.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:31
Oh, that’s, that’s awesome. I would love that too. So as I said, Lisa is a pharmacist and I just wanted to know the set when and how did you become a pharmacist? Why did you become a pharmacist?

Lisa King, RPh 1:44
Well, I have to say I knew very early on that I wanted to become a pharmacist. I wanted to go into the medical profession, but I graduated just shy of being 23 years old. I have a Bachelor of Science in pharmacy. I’m back. I’m old school. Me too. So, So I back in the day, I wanted to go into medicine, but this is my thinking in my, you know, teen years. I didn’t want to touch anybody. So I’d like pharmacy that sounds perfect. And my grandmother absolutely loved her pharmacist, I always say she wanted everyone to be pharmacists in the family. And I’m the only one who listened to her. So she just, I mean, even I remember as a little girl, she would talk about her pharmacist all the time, and she really just encouraged that. And so my family was just really excited when I went into pharmacy school I knew early on. So I didn’t take a lot of classes that didn’t count or anything like that. I did two years of pre pharmacy and then went to the University of Arizona. I graduated in 1988. And with a Bachelor of Science in pharmacy, and so I have just loved it ever since.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 2:48
Well, we are very close. I graduated in 93. So we’re five years apart. And I was very young to a graduated at 22. And you know, you would think well you don’t know what you’re doing at that age. You can doubt yourself. But when you have that motivation and you have that drive, I just, you know, I wanted to be a doctor. But my dog got sick and I took her to the vet and she started bleeding and they fainted. So I’m like, Okay, I’m not gonna be a doctor. So we’re have that in common, as well. So tell me what kind of pharmacy jobs have you had? What what is it that have you based your experience mainly on?

Lisa King, RPh 3:26
Well, I’ve always worked retail, I knew that I wanted to help people. That was really my calling. I just really wanted to connect with my patients. And since I do a lot online now, a lot of people think that I have some sort of glamorous pharmacy job. The funny thing about it is my Instagram handle is the @fulfilledpharmacist and people often ask me, Are you really a pharmacist? And I’m thinking, I don’t know who would pretend to work, as a pharmacist. It’s not like a glamorous job where you say, Oh, I’m a pharmacist because it’s not glamorous at all. And then they think Well, okay, well, maybe she really is a pharmacist but it must be you know, some really, you know, slick compounding pharmacy or something but I’ve always worked retail and the last part I’ve only had two jobs since I graduated. One job I was in for about six, seven years and then the other 25 years was in grocery retail because it was a little bit of a slower studying and so when I first started in grocery retail I could work 20 hours a week and still be home with my children. So I’ve always worked retail and I’ve always loved working with my patients and really loved it.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 4:32
Well, you are glamorous lady so it doesn’t matter what profession you have. You make a glamorous so thank you for doing that for our profession because we always are in a ponytail, maybe a little bit of makeup and off we go because we’re always busy.

Lisa King, RPh 4:46
Well honestly, that’s how I usually go to the pharmacy with not much makeup glasses on. I found that and maybe it was a little bit more with early on as opposed to you know, now that I’m in my 50s people don’t really care How I look but I felt like when I was younger people would say they were a bit more concentrated on you know what I was wearing or my makeup or something I’m like no, I want to be you know, I’m here to help you I want to be known for what I’m thinking and, and sharing with you not what I’m wearing. So I kind of always kind of dressed down at the pharmacy as well.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 5:19
But looks are the first impression and when you are looking professional people tend to be more open to you. So you did good. We did. And being a pharmacist is a it’s a privilege because people come to you when you when they are in a in a distressed situation. So having somebody that is knowledgeable in the other side smiling and looking good is a plus.

Lisa King, RPh 5:42
Thank you. Yes, we really are the most accessible. I mean very accessible and I love that about being a pharmacist that people can talk to you. I mean, over the counter that’s you know, I worked retail. So over talking to people over the counter was a big part of my job and I always enjoyed that.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 6:00
Actually, I was talking about that with one of my friends and colleagues also Swapna that the episode dropped today, we’re the day that we’re recording this drop that episode is episode number 12. And she also says that we are the most accessible; you can just walk in and we’re there. You don’t have to make an appointment with us. You didn’t have to wait hours didn’t have to wait with other people that are waiting there. Most of the time in 10 minutes or less, we’re going to be there for the patient. So yeah, we are the most accessible and thank you for doing that.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 6:28
So, you hinted Senora that you’re doing something different now. So that means that you’re not practicing pharmacy, as dispensing medications anymore,right?

Lisa King, RPh 6:38
No, I’m not I in late November, I stepped out of the pharmacy. I stepped down for being a staff pharmacist. I’m still filling in PRN, not on call but just in case of emergency if they need me and I’ve worked about four days since then. But now what I do is; I’ve always loved sharing health information and even in the pharmacy people would be very surprised because be telling them. Oh, well, you know, this is maybe something you should eat if you know, if you are, you know, have high blood pressure, take down some sodium in your diet, things like that. I love sharing health information, whether I’m in the pharmacy or out. So now I’m mostly doing it outside the pharmacy and sharing on social media as the fulfilled pharmacists. So I talk a lot about disease prevention just, help a healthy lifestyle. And my specialty is also bladder health, which we will get into in just a bit. But one of the things someone recently asked me is how did you come up with the name the fulfilled pharmacist? It was it was just a name I had in mind. But really, my big thing is you don’t want to just live a long life. You want to live a long and fulfilled life. And to do that you have toprevent disease, stay healthy, feel the best that you can have more energy to spend time with your family and feel really fulfilled; so that that’s kind of where my name came in into play a little bit too.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 7:58
So the question is, is that what you Do you a fulfill pharmacist, lady?

Lisa King, RPh 8:03
I work on it every day. I feel like being fulfilled as a work in progress. So I’m all about you know, waking up early in the morning, having time to myself reading, self development, books, journaling, that type of thing. But I’m all about, you know, body mind spirit. So I really feel like being part of being fulfilled is not only leading a healthy lifestyle on the outside, but on the inside, too.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 8:26
We as humans are the most critical of ourselves, but from the outside because I don’t know Lisa, personally, we just met through the vines through Sharzad Green, which also Yes, the show and her episode about BioIdenticals or menopause. hormonal been a post replacement. She is one of the most popular episodes and because she’s the sweetest, and she talked to me about you, and then we connected so thank you Sharzad for that. for that. Shout out to her. And we’re going to have her back soon too because there’s a lot that She wants to give and she’s a great educator.

Lisa King, RPh 9:02
I learned so much from her all the time. And I love listening to her.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 9:06
And she has a patient voice. And she’s so accommodating. It’s like, I love talking to you is so relaxing. And I learned so much. So it is great. But when I started following you on Instagram, which is the main window or platform that you have, I’m like, this lady has it together. She’s gorgeous. She’s very outspoken. She’s very focused on what she wants to do. And your people follow you, they understand that they see that. And even though as I said, we are the main critics of ourselves, if you don’t think that if you don’t feel like your fulfilled; you look very much so. So. Good job so far.

Lisa King, RPh 9:49
Thank you!

Marilena Grittani, RPh 9:51
So tell me about what is it that you specifically work on and the motivation to do it. No, it’s basically about bladder. But I want to know, why did you started on this path.

Lisa King, RPh 10:06
One of the reasons I got started on social media was I just really wanted to share more about, you know, a healthy lifestyle. And for me, that was because my mom and my sister are both breast cancer survivors. So I started doing a lot of different things to prevent that disease for myself, and it just kept morphing into more things. My sister and I, about two years ago, wrote a book called tiny life changes. And we both went through a very difficult time in our lives about the same time My sister was diagnosed with breast cancer at the age of 35. And we just had a huge charity event, for her charity that she founded here in Phoenix.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 10:42
beautiful picture I love it

Unknown Speaker 10:44
honestly need to post pictures. One of my favorite days of the year and my sister helped thousands of women. When she was diagnosed, she had so much help and she thought, I know there’s other women just exactly like me. Her baby was 11 months old. She couldn’t even lift her own baby when she had her double mastectomy. And so she wants to help other women who are going through the same thing. So she has, it’s been amazing. And so we wrote this book, I was going through the downturn of 2008. Right when about when she was going through her breast cancer diagnosis. And we both came through a very difficult situation, feeling that we really bloomed and we’re for the better for it. So we wanted to kind of put pen to paper and share that with other people. So tiny life changes is the book that we wrote into kind of a journal style book. It’s very simple read, you could probably read it in one day. It gives you different exercises that you can do to feel more fulfilled, to make those tiny changes that lead to big results in better health and whatever goals you want to achieve.

Lisa King, RPh 11:44
But, when I since I was on social media somehow along the line, I had shared that I was diagnosed with interstitial cystitis, which is painful bladder syndrome. Now, when I was on a podcast for tiny life changes someone asked me about that. And from that it just seemed like every other podcast I went on, people wanted to ask me about the interstitial cystitis, and I was at first like, this is in my past, I don’t want to talk about this terrible time in my life. I don’t worry about this. I’m like, I’m over it. I’m done. And I just started getting more and more questions about, well, how did you heal your body? What did you do to create an environment of healing in your body, and I was kind of floundering a bit because I was talking about health and wellness, that I was talking about tiny life changes. And I was like, I don’t know what to post. I don’t know what to say, I don’t know if I should talk about health, talk about the book. And then I was talking to a friend who’s a kind of a business mentor to me, and she’s like, I think you should tell talk to people about bladder health. I mean, there are so many women suffering in silence. You’re getting all these messages from women who want to talk to you about this. You need to start sharing about this. Yeah. And I really felt at that moment, she was so right. I mean, Who was I to not share what I did for myself to help myself feel better? Because it’s an extremely painful condition. I mean, there are women just devastated by the pain they’re going through. And from there, it just kind of blossomed into women asking me about overactive bladder about chronic UTI is about painful bladder syndrome. So that’s kind of where I am. And this just really started maybe in the last year where I’ve been sharing about bladder health.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 13:28
But now you’re the expert because you’ve done it for so long. And you have so many followers and people asking you and you have been helping them. So one of the things that I wanted to say this is in a personal level, sorry, listeners you have to deal with this is that when you reach out to somebody that might know a little bit of what you’re going through, you have to be desperate. So when these ladies reached out to you, they truly needed help. So the fact that you said okay, this is not what I want to remember Because it was painful for me for because I know what you’re going through, I’m gonna give you a hand. That speaks very loud of the type of person that you are of the type of healthcare provider that you are. And for that I’m very happy that you did that for them, because I know helping others feels really good in your heart.

Lisa King, RPh 14:19
Well, thank you. And honestly, I really I like talking to these ladies. I feel like a pharmacist when I’m doing this. And so I’ve been a pharmacist for so long. I mean, it’s what I do. And the ladies that I work with, that’s one of the big things that I hear from them most often is that even though they may have a wonderful doctor or a wonderful pelvic floor, physical therapist, they’re going to, these people don’t know the pain that they’re in, they can talk to them about how to alleviate the pain, but they know that I was exactly in their position. And it was horrific for me. I mean, I barely left my house. I was urinating every 15 minutes. I had two toddlers at the time. I could barely walk, I could barely lift My own baby. So when people see that I’ve gotten better, I’ve been medication free for about 17 years now. They think, Oh, well, maybe her case wasn’t so bad. But I did, actually and we’ll talk a little bit about what interstitial cystitis is. I did actually have bladder ulceration. Not everyone does.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 15:16
But it was not the simple case.

Lisa King, RPh 15:18
No, it wasn’t when I was went to Mayo Clinic because I was going for multiple diagnosis to talk to different urologist to see what what we could do. The Mayo Clinic told me that that I had one of the worst cases they had ever seen of bladder ulceration. So it was it was very, very severe. So So the fact that I am feeling so much better today and that I can lead a life where I can spend time with my family and travel and go to the movies and sit through a movie or go to my son’s wedding. I mean, it’s amazing to me, I mean, I’m so grateful that I am where I am.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 15:51
You are living proof that you can improve. So that means that even though you had a really really bad case, you learn how How to deal with it. You treated it the proper way. And that is a window for those that are having the issue now, that are feeling hopeless, that they could be like you. So that is something that anybody that is passing through a bad situation is looking for. And I believe that that’s the reason why you have so many followers and they ask you for specific trainings because it’s not easy to be alone. Is not always easy to be alone in pain. And it’s not easy to be alone in pain with something that is not that common, or at least not that known. So why don’t you tell us how common This is? Is it really because some people have never heard about it.

Lisa King, RPh 16:40
Well, interstitial cystitis which is hard to pronounce. Now, they often call it painful bladder syndrome. Back when I was first diagnosed, they thought that you had to have the ulcers on your bladder, they’re called Hunter’s ulcers. And now they’re finding it’s more of what we call an umbrella terminology. So it can really encompass many different things. So basically it’s having a painful bladder without a known cause not having a bladder infection or anything like that even though it often feels like a bladder infection for six weeks or more. So, it could be because you have ulceration, it could be because you have pelvic floor dysfunction. It could be because you have heightened mast cells, which are the cells that are kind of triggered when you have allergies. Women who have interstitial cystitis have a lot of mast cells in their bladders. And it could be from numerous different causes. A lot of it, is due to stress. Sometimes people feel like they’re having flares when they’re under stress, but that’s because the mast cells become more heightened in the bladder. It’s very controlled by diet, so diet is the one of the forefront treatments for interstitial cystitis, but it really is now thought to be more of what we call an umbrella terminology. So that makes it a little bit harder to treat, because not everybody is presenting in the same way. So I maybe was feeling better because I I had the ulcers and I was able to heal the ulcers where other women who have pelvic floor dysfunction may need to go to a pelvic floor physical therapist to help theirs. But what I really did want to say was, that you have to have hope yet as we talked a little bit before, when my sister had her tea the other day that we were just talking about the theme of the tea was hope. And the lady who was the guest speaker was talking about when she was going through her own breast cancer diagnosis. She didn’t listen to, to statistics, because she said to her doctor, don’t deny me of my hope. And when I was diagnosed, which was now 26 years ago, I keep telling people 25, but it’s now closer to 26. There was no internet. So even though this I had this horrific chronic disease, I wasn’t able to go online, to hear other people talking about it. So I feel like a lot of times the internet is good and bad because you can get some great information. But the ladies often that I talked to wind up in trouble groups where women are saying, I’ve had this for 20 years, and I’ve never gotten better. So that really denied their hope. Yes. So that is one of my biggest things is I’m here to give you hope that you can get better. And one of the things about interstitial cystitis that I’ve often read is that a lot of times people don’t believe they can get better. Because it’s so horrible that when people finally do get better, they don’t want to talk about it anymore. I want to talk about that.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 17:32
Just like you.

Lisa King, RPh 19:28
Exactly. But I have met numerous women who have gotten better, and I and there’s a nice little community of women that I often share their information or their table share mind. And we have all gotten better. So I mean, it’s something that is possible. It’s possible.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 19:44
And for that, I applaud you for doing that. The problem that we have in this society, mostly in the US and I’m not talking about the rest of the world because I just lived here for the past 20 years; Is that you believe that the doctor is The one that knows, and whoever the doctor is, it doesn’t have to be a specialist. It doesn’t have to be the top of the line doctor, is the doctor that you have. And if the doctor says A, B or Z, you believe it with your heart. And maybe that doctor didn’t know maybe that doctor never understood maybe that doctor was not comfortable referring you with somebody else. And that denied you of your hope. And that is something that I’m trying to battle here. And that’s why most of the people that I’m interviewing are alternative, non that is alternative medicine in terms of drink this tea or do this exercise only is professionals that are in healthcare, but are doing stuff differently. And not necessarily because you’re not a physician. That doesn’t mean that you cannot help and you’re not an expert on that area. So I motivate my listeners to listen to alternatives that are out there and to listen and to pay attention to how much of an expert People are in those areas that your physician might not know the case of hormonal replacement. How many people are suffering with menopause symptoms? Because the doctor said, I believe that they cause cancer. Well, some of them do if you didn’t do it properly, they do. Listen to that episode, Episode Number six, and then you will understand. Oh, okay, yeah, exactly. I understand. I’m gonna put that in the show notes because you need to listen to our set. Right Lisa? She’s off.

Lisa King, RPh 21:26
Yes, well and a lot that’s she and I work a lot together because a lot of the women that I talked to who have chronic UTI is especially as they’re getting older, it’s due to battle dryness. So Shahrzad has a wonderful product fab you batch that I recommend all the time to women who may not want to go take the time to go to their doctor or don’t want to take a prescription estrogen product or it’s not covered by their insurance is a wonderful product that’s federal based that I recommend all the time.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 21:54
And he’s not only that is created by somebody that understands what the situation is and When you talk to somebody that understands as a female, as the age bracket that you are, and also professionally speaking has more than 20,000 patients that you have seen, you know, you know that that person is an expert. So that’s what I’m trying to advocate. Because some people like you, Lisa are in the shadows. Not that you want to be simply, well, most people believe that physicians are the way to go. But I’m not saying that it’s not I’m just saying that a shirt that also mentioned because she is that good is a triangle is the doctor, the patient and the pharmacist, the doctor diagnosis, the patient knows what she or he feels and how it’s improving or not. And the pharmacists, the one that can tweak the medications, and can tweak certain areas that the doctor has no idea about. So it is a different way to approach but they only benefit from this is that the patient gets the best of two big important professionals and to get better so For that I propose to everybody just give it a chance. Take a little Yeah, listen and see what it is. And in your case, Lisa, because you’re so accessible as a pharmacist and online, you have constant content in your Instagram and your ID and if you want to know what Lisa is doing, or what Lisa is about, you just have to look for her posts or a couple of her stories and then understand what she’s about what she’s talking about. And then that relationship that trust will build there and maybe not with questions that you personally have. But other people will ask that demonstrates how much of an expert she is and and how passionate because that is very noticeable in your ID account. You are well thank you and that’s what you need. You need somebody that is approachable. Somebody that is knowledgeable and somebody that cares, because when you’re in those situations you feel lost.

Lisa King, RPh 23:54
Yes. And I really as you touched about before I I really feel like I heard about What once instrum Dr. Lisa Rankin she wrote a book called mind over medicine and it’s her quote is, I’m not for Eastern medicine. I’m not for Western medicine. I’m for what’s best for the patient. Exactly. And so and I really truly feel that and that’s what I like to come across as well with what I post and what I talked to the ladies that I talked to who have painful bladders, it really is all about not only the dietary changes because dietary changes are very much known with interstitial cystitis and of course medications but there’s also lifestyle changes and mindset changes that need to be done as well and for myself, I was you know, sticking with the interstitial cystitis diet and if anybody wants to see the full list of foods to avoid you can find that in my free report on my website, ditch bladder pain calm, but there are foods to avoid that are you know, I’ll give you just some examples. spicy foods, acidic foods, carbonated foods, chocolate, alcohol, those are just some of the foods but I was avoiding the foods I was going to the doctor taking medications But it wasn’t until I really started doing some self care changing my mindset. It was like the icing on the cake my bladder finally started getting better. So I took every day to meditate. So I recommend this to everybody. And it was a healing meditation where I would breathe in and just picture like a healing light going into my bladder picturing my bladder feeling that energy just swirling my bladder and then breathing out and I would do this every day for half hour right before my kids came home from school and I would wind up falling asleep but it was really what my body needed because you know as pharmacists we are typing. So all of my symptoms really started occurring when I was in pharmacy school when I went down to the University of Arizona because I felt like that I had so much pressure on myself I was under so much stress just probably run down not eating right, my my immune system was was low. And this continued on for years till I finally got my diagnosis. And there was there’s a little saying in the ICU unit that it takes eight years and eight doctors before you’ll get a diagnosis. And this was the same thing for me. It was about eight years before I was finally diagnosed. But I feel like when you’re constantly under so much stress, and those mast cells are firing in your body, and you’re not allowing yourself time to heal, it’s hard to heal, because healing is not linear. And it does take a while. So it can happen, but it’s not going to be overnight. It’s not where you take that pill, and it happens overnight where you’re better, but you have to give yourself that time and that grace, and for me healing meditation or taking that time or waking up early and having that piece that’s so important. And I really, that’s what I like to talk to the ladies who I talked about, about as well is taking that time to really give yourself time to heal. It’s not going to happen overnight, but you need to give yourself that time because healing takes a lot of energy

Marilena Grittani, RPh 26:54
purchase because I just had a surgery and asking with crutches and I am just 40 And I feel very limited, and it’s frustrating. And I just wanted to get bed better the next day. And as a pharmacist, I know that pills are not always the solution. And I’m not popping medications because that’s not what it is. I don’t like pain medication. So I’m just going through it the correct way. But yeah, I don’t have patience and pharmacists have not come up with a patient formula yet. No, by and then, maybe a little central oils lab. Trust me, I’ve tried everything. And yeah, it’s our thing. But the problem that we have these days is that most people saying that I just need to take a pill and he will fix it. And we pharmacists know that that’s not the solution. Nobody knows drugs better than us. And we are the worst pain medication takers. It’s not that we are not we’re against them is that we know that we just take it when it’s absolutely necessary. We don’t just don’t pop pills like that. Would you elaborate a little bit more on that please?

Lisa King, RPh 28:00
Yes, I agree and and I really feel like a lot of times the medication is just masking. Yeah. You know, the pain and really, you have to get to the the root of it. So for women who have interstitial cystitis, which is now also thought to be autoimmune, a lot of it comes from, you know, leaky gut syndrome, which is potentially not having good gut health where food against and yes, the toxins in your body, you know, leak out through the lining of the gut membrane and go into the bloodstream and they can trigger all sorts of autoimmune responses. So a lot of the women I talked to don’t realize that they have more than one autoimmune disease and that it’s all tied together. So they may have interstitial cystitis and fibromyalgia, or interstitial cystitis and Ms or, or something like that, or Hashimoto. So I really helped them to just have more nutrient dense foods to eat healthier, to heal that gut mining, start taking a probiotic and a lot of these women Also have recurrent UTI eyes. So they’re on a lot of different antibiotics. So I’m all about gut health following the interstitial cystitis diet, but also beyond that healing your body through nutrition, as we just talked about. So it all really ties together. It’s all just about healing the body as a whole, taking down inflammation in the entire body, which will then take down inflammation in the bladder.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 29:25
Yeah, because what people think is I have pain here. So I need a pill that is going to take care of the pain, but the pain is just a sign is not the problem. Mm hmm. Exactly. That is telling you something is wrong. Research, find out what’s wrong and fix it. So the pain will go away. Rather than masking, as you said, the situation by taking pain medications, either even other over the counter or the ones that are not prescription, or the ones that the doctor sends you because if you go to the ER with a pain, you’re like, Oh, I’m in pain and they look Do you have anything here’s the pain medication go Home? How does that fix the problem? And sometimes most of the time, I would say is that it is a global approachment on your body as a whole. And as most of the time we say it You are what you eat. Yes affects so many areas of your health. And then some people will be in the bladder, but other people who’ve been their stomach and exactly mental health, so yeah, it’s hard. It’s a, it’s a whole body treatment, what we need to do rather than just

Lisa King, RPh 30:32
exactly but then on the other hand, since I am a pharmacist, I do encourage these ladies to not feel bad if they do have to take medication, because so many of them want to go about it in a holistic way and they feel bad if they do have to take the medication but there’s no shame in that. So if you do need to take it, then that’s what it’s there for. But you still want to be healing your body as a whole while you’re on the medication and then it all all come together.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 30:58
How people know that they have this thing. on how to diagnosis

Lisa King, RPh 31:01
Basically interstitial cystitis years ago, it also was known as Hunter’s ulcers so they thought that you had to have ulcers on your bladder, but now it is also known as an umbrella diagnosis. So it can be due to the alteration on the bladder it can be due to pelvic floor dysfunction, it can be due to increased mass cells in the bladder, so it’s there. It’s a bit difficult to diagnose. Traditionally, it was diagnosed by hydro distension of the bladder, so basically they fill your bladder up with water to see if you have alter ulcers on your bladder when I had my hydro distension. It really and this isn’t for everybody, but for me, and as we talked about, you know, things are different for different people. It’s poor all my ulcerations open so it really was extremely painful and it took me a while to heal. So sometimes now they’ll just do it by symptoms. So women who have interstitial cystitis, they can at any stage they could be urinating 60 times a day. I was going about every 15 minutes. It’s nice like pain, it’s severe pain. I had a friend recently who messaged me and she said, I have like a throbbing pain. And I and but she’s like, I don’t know if it’s more, you know, female issues or bladder and I’m like this is this is severe pain. I mean it’s nice like pain, I would feel like almost like somebody was sticking a knife flight into me every time I urinated. I barely stand up so, and a lot of times that presents like a bladder infection, so a lot of women will get it after having several different bladder infections, because there’s that irritation on the bladder lining, and it kind of just keeps moving forward. But a lot of times I would go to the doctor and they would say, Well, it sounds like you have a urinary tract infection, but I don’t see any bacteria in your urine, but I’m going to give you an antibiotic anyway. So yeah, and so a lot of times now they’re even saying it could be an embedded infection, where it’s actually an infection that there’s a thing called a biofilm where the Bacteria stick to your bladder wall. So a lot of times when you urinate, you’re not really seeing that bacteria in the urine because it’s stuck to the bladder wall. And there’s a lot of specialists who deal with that. And one of the easiest ways to think of a biofilm is the plaque on your teeth in the morning. So when you wake up in the morning, there’s that sticky plaque on your teeth. That’s kind of how the biofilm forms in the bladder sticks to the bladder wall. So sometimes that bacteria really doesn’t present. There’s different ways to find it now. So there’s just many different things. So if you talk to one urologist and you don’t get the answers that you want to hear, you may want to get a second opinion and as I’ve said, it’s sometimes takes eight years eight doctors to get hopefully not a diagnosis. Yeah, but

Marilena Grittani, RPh 33:42
Then when they get into a group like yours, where people would say okay, this is the type of doctor so you need to go you don’t go to your primary care physician that has a PA that is a family practitioner to get diagnosed with something like this. They might refer you or not, but you need to be the advocate for your own health. So the more you get educated by people that know by professionals, then you do what you need to do. Again, it’s not what your friend says. It’s not what your neighbor says, unless your neighbor is a pharmacist or a doctor, right? You just go with the primary source, which is the people that know and then ask the question specifically. So the symptoms just to recap, are sharp pain when you urinate urinating a lot of times a day more than 20 times a day more than 15 times a day. Um, you know, it’s hard to say it’s just frequent urination, because I just want people to say, Well, I go 20 times a day, but that’s normal for me. So that but that’s not normal. It might be no, I

Lisa King, RPh 34:41
would say I would say if you’re uncomfortable, you know, some women you know, may have overactive bladder and can still live with it. If you if you’re not able to live with your symptoms, then seek a second opinion. Yeah, if

Marilena Grittani, RPh 34:52
you if you have overactive I mean you pee too much. If you have pain, excruciating pain when you pee and you don’t feel that that is being resolved by an antibiotic because it’s not an infection, then you might suspect on this and then start looking forward to an expert looking for it,

Lisa King, RPh 35:09
right. And it’s almost a throbbing pain. You know, I was talking about this with the lady that I work with, you know how like, you know, you don’t really know where your organs are in your body. You don’t really know where your heart is where your liver is. I mean, you know where your bladder is, I mean, this bladder is painful bladder syndrome, your bladder is just throbbing, you have the sensation all the time, a lot of times you can even feel that your real pain feels very swollen. every step you take, you’ll feel your bladder so you will kind of know if you have it just from some of those symptoms. And a lot of times, you know, and unfortunately this happened to me and it’s happened to a lot of ladies, you’ll talk to your doctor and they’ll think it’s all in your head. So one of the times I was even seeing a urologist it wasn’t even a regular doctor and he’s like, you know what I think you need to see a psychologist because this is getting really out of control. Went to the psychologist who back then wasn’t even very familiar with interstitial cystitis. And she told me after I met with her a few times, she said, you know, Lisa, I thought this was all in your head. So she said until I started doing some research on this. So you know, women get still get this, you know, 27 years later people say, you know, I think this pain is all in your head. So, if you have that pain, you have to really advocate for yourself. It’s not in your head. It’s a real thing. So if

Marilena Grittani, RPh 36:24
you have this happen, if you have the centum start listening to Lisa, with Lisa, the content that Lisa prepares all the time, and then if you find that you might have that then you can go directly to the specialists that you need to go to Lisa, how many women really have this problem? Because you have a big group and I’m thinking well, he said that many?

Lisa King, RPh 36:47
Well, about three to 8 million women in the US have interstitial cystitis, but there’s over 30 million women, women over the age of 40, you have overactive bladder. So a lot of the things that I talked to women about Who have interstitial cystitis also fit in with overactive bladder because a lot of those foods are also triggers. And I can’t tell you how many women reach out to me saying, Oh my gosh, after I started following you, my overactive bladder is better because, you know, they’re having, you know, maybe two, three cups of coffee in the morning. Even things that are really healthy for you, for someone who has a painful bladder can be very irritating. So, for instance, I had one lady who is using Apple Cider Vinegar every morning and vinegar is very acidic. It’s very for someone who has an irritated bladder lining, that’s going to irritate it even more. So she was using Apple Cider Vinegar every morning and her bladder was just getting worse and worse. And I’ve had also other ladies that I’ve talked to using high amounts of vitamin C, which is if you read on the internet, that’s really good for preventing UTI, but not if you have a painful bladder lining, that ascorbic acid is going to irritate the bladder lining. So there’s a lot of different things that I talked to these ladies about That kind of there’s a lot of information out there and sometimes you don’t know what you really believe or not. So I kind of help them assimilate that for them because sometimes it frustrates me even. I want to drink, you know, some sort of juice that could be healing that I read about, but having interstitial cystitis is there’s only several fruits that you can have pears, blueberries, and melons except for cantaloupe. So I can’t have you know, all the green drink with the lemon juice in it in the morning. So there’s a lot of things that I can’t have that are thought to be healthy. But you know, we’re not for you chub, they’re from it’s fermented, you can’t have fermented foods. So those are all the foods that I have to avoid. But you know, you learn to eat around it.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 38:49
Yes. Well, that that takes us to a point that I have made my mission to emphasize in every episode that I can that is not what is good for you. would be good for me. Right? You, you need to understand that we’re different humans even if you’re twins, identical twins, the bodies are different, it does not work the same. So be mindful of the fact that not because a doctor that recommended to somebody that has certain situations or certain diseases or illnesses in their life and it was prescribed by a physician means that it will do the same for you how many people you have out there that say what, what worked for you, would you tell me so I’ll use the same that is very responsible is very responsible from the person that says use this because it worked for me. And it’s also very responsible for the person that takes it because that person is not a physician is not a doctor is not a pharmacist, it’s not somebody that knows what’s going on with you and recommended something like that might hurt you. Like the case that you were talking about. The apple apple cider vinegar. Yeah, there’s a lot of people that say every morning I take it in my healthiest one Did that person have the same situations that you obviously not, and instead of helping you was hurting her? So back mindful of this, take it from who it comes from? And if you have questions, find people experts in the area like Lisa, and then should her dm and say, Hey, Lisa, this is what I heard. People are saying that this work for my sister, whatever question you want to ask, and then Lisa will clarify it. And most likely, because I follow her, she would do a post about it, hey, somebody asked me about this. And I want everybody to be on the same page, because most people think the same way. So it is important to deal and to approach it with an expert, not the neighbor, not somebody that had something similar because you have no idea if it is similar or not. It might sound to you because you’re not an expert. But when you talk to us or the people that is an expert, they’re gonna be like that is nothing related to each other. So please don’t do it anymore. And don’t harm yourself trying to help

Lisa King, RPh 41:00
Right guess what even it’s funny. Um, you know, just because I’ve worked retail for so long, you know, one of the things is people will say, you know, I have a cough or something. And I’ll go out and recommend, you know, according to their symptoms, what I think and then they’ll say, Oh, well, my neighbor told me this. So this is the one I’m going to get. I think that they just wanted me to see if I was going to recommend the same thing. And when I don’t, they’re like, Oh, I’m gonna just get this one. I’m like, okay,

Marilena Grittani, RPh 41:24
I just have an expert. Okay, well, good. To me make the decisions and that’s what it is you decide whatever you want to do. But come on your neighbor more than a pharmacist that is disrespectful. Anyways. So what is the bladder? And what is it that he does anyway? So why does it happen there?

Lisa King, RPh 41:45
Well, basically, the bladder is a hollow muscular organ, it’s the holding tank for urine. So as your urine passes through the kidneys, kind of holds there and then you urinated out as a way of natural detoxing. So So, one of the things about it is that I often talk about that a lot of ladies don’t realize is that I am really a big proponent of reducing toxins in Skincare Makeup your skin is your largest organ and it absorbs everything. So basically a toxin is something that your body can’t use for energy. So you breathe in toxins, you get toxins in the foods that you eat through preservatives, you know, chemicals and things that you put on your skin, your cleaning products. So a lot of ladies that I talked to can often have triggers because basically as they’re absorbing all this and it’s coming out the bladder through the urine, you know, they’re triggered by different fragrances incense and their soaps, you know, as they’re cleaning or even just bathing at night. I’ve had women tell me that they’ve had flares every night after bathing just because they didn’t realize that there’s soaps had so much fragrance and irritation to them. I had recently just posted about this I had a lady who shared with me that she got a new car and just from all that new cars smell and all the chemicals and the carpeting and you know the leather and all that it was flaring her bladder because so that’s one thing that I’d like to talk about too just as a lifestyle change. And it is a lifestyle change even for autoimmune disease to help reduce those toxins so that they’re not irritating your bladder, they’re not triggering an already heightened immune system to give you more symptoms of autoimmune disease. So that’s one thing right there so that that bladder really is a holding tank.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 43:26
Just to elaborate a little bit more on what you said. I remember when I was working in retail a patient came coming back saying I have this reaction this skin reaction It was like a rash and she was very uncomfortable with it and she said everything’s absolutely clean. I make sure I wash it and wash it and it’s so clean. of the soap was the problem. The soap was the problem and she thought she was fixing it with it. So whenever you feel that something is very topical or in the certain area you have to think out of the box because you think is cleaning cannot be doing anything to me. So that’s why you need to talk to people that are, you know, number one objective and number two knowledgeable that stuff like this could happen. And yeah, you will not expect it.

Lisa King, RPh 44:13
And I’ve had that a lot in the pharmacy because I am so passionate about reducing toxins. I’ve had people who have had rashes for years and when I tell them to go with you know, non toxic you know, I wouldn’t say organic but it should say like fragrance free, paraben free, Balliett free on the soaps that you pick and go with a more natural like fragrance free, you know, cleaning product for laundry. Like Lisa my rash cleared up. And one patient the same thing she wound up in her was a man actually he wound up in the hospital, head to toe rash because he was elderly. He was in bed all day. And his daughters came in and they said Lisa, you wouldn’t believe the smell in my parents house. My mom just uses such strong laundry detergent. And they figured out it was from I’m laying in bed all day, just on your sheets that were, you know, had so much chemicals and so many chemicals in the laundry.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 45:07
Yeah. And if you think you’re doing something good again, you’re trying, but your knowledge is limited. So that’s why you have to go and consult the experts on this specific area, because, as I discussed with most of my guests at this point, I wouldn’t talk to you about oncology. And I wouldn’t want you to give me a recommendation about a particular oncology medication because that’s not your area of expertise now, and it is the responsible way for us to say, you know what, I have an idea but I’m not an expert. I would recommend that you go find somebody or go talk to this person that I trust, and then this person might help you. That is okay. And I just don’t know why some physicians and PhDs and and nurse practitioners feel very uncomfortable with that. And the only one that loses is the patient. In our dedication, our commitment is with them. So if the patient is not treated well, because we can’t, and we’re not that good, we’re just good at certain stuff. It is responsible to refer. So when somebody when a doctor or a nurse practitioner or a pharmacist tells you, Hey, I don’t really know, go find somebody that is an expert. Don’t take it, like this person is been rude to you. I’m not trying to help you. It’s simply that this person doesn’t know and you will be better off with somebody that does. Absolutely. Okay, so let’s just talk about something that is like a taboo in our gender. That is, well I get multiple urinary infections, it might be because I have sex and is that dirty. What is true about that?

Lisa King, RPh 46:43
Well, you know, there’s that could be because of that just because of the female anatomy. It could be for several different things, hygiene issues, you know, having intimacy. So I talk about this a lot too, because a lot of times women come to me either right before or after. They travels. So when you’re traveling, there’s more of an increased chance of having bladder irritation for several reasons, increased chance of UTI because you’re not getting to the bathroom as frequently you’re looking for bathrooms, you’re holding it. So you want to urinate about every four hours. That’s the time it takes for bacteria to travel up the urethra. So if you’re wanting to prevent UTI,

Marilena Grittani, RPh 47:20
urinate every Hold on, they said repeat that slowly because I want people to get it

Lisa King, RPh 47:24
right. So it’s okay if you are anytime even if you’re not traveling, you want to urinate about every four hours, so there’s no prize and holding it a long time, because that’s the time it takes for bacteria to head up the urethra and can possibly cause a UTI. So you want to urinate more frequently so you can flush it out. So you want to stay hydrated. A lot of times when people are traveling, they’re not as hydrated. They’re not drinking as much because they can’t get to that bathroom so they don’t want to drink. So stay hydrated. Oftentimes, there’s more intimacy and a lot of times with intimacy, you’ll want Avoid afterwards and there’s just more increased chance of that bacteria heading up their urethra again just because of female anatomy. And also you’re having more sugar, you’re you’re going out to dinner, you’re drinking more alcohol, having more sugar and sugar is kind of a food for bacteria. They love it, that unhealthy bacteria, it kind of really feeds while you’re having more sugar in your diet. So those are some tips while you’re traveling that you’ll want to really look at. There’s several different things that I recommend and I wanted to talk about this demand also something I recommend all the time d mannose is a natural sugar that bacteria what the bad bacteria will adhere to and you can help flush them out. So basically, instead of sticking to your bladder wall, the bacteria will adhere to the demand house and it will then you’ll urinate it out so it helps prevent UTI. So basically d mannose is a natural sugar that’s not absorbed. It’s the sugar that’s in cranberries. So a lot of times when they say to drink the cranberry Juice. It’s because of that it has different things in it. But one of the things is d mannose. I prefer de mano silver cranberry because cranberry can be irritating to the bladder. Yes, and in females is very soothing. So even for women who don’t have UTI, but just have bladder irritation, you can use D Nanos. And there’s one that I recommend all the time I can give the name of it to you to put in your show notes. I was

Marilena Grittani, RPh 49:23
happy to put in us a link there. Absolutely. So you can just click on it and get it. Very good. That’s very interesting. And I

Lisa King, RPh 49:30
I will add, just because of bacterial resistance, you chronic UTI are becoming more and more common. So, so it’s not like in the old days where you could just treat a UTI and I’ll go away, just bacterial resistance is making them more common. So that’s another thing that we’re dealing with right now as well.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 49:48
I actually talked about bacterial resistance and the way that they get stronger in Episode #9, where I explain why bacteria If you don’t finish a treatment with antibody, why they come back and they come back stronger and they cannot, you cannot take the same antibiotic treated, that’s why they change it. So I will encourage you to go listen to episode #9. And listen to that because knowing or information is power. So if you understand what it is and why you have to do it, you will be more informed and educated. So you will do it for that reason. So, yeah, bacterial resistance is something big that we are causing ourselves and it’s not helping anybody, so we need to be mindful about that. So, Lisa, is it true that we can eat our way out of interstitial cystitis?

Lisa King, RPh 50:41
Well, that is the the primary treatment is diet, the diet that’s the first step I would say that you know, there’s a lot of different things that people will do, but the interstitial cystitis diet is one of the first things removing those acidic foods, citric foods, coffee, fermented foods, and it says I A step by step plan I have through my program at ditch bladder pain calm. This is very overwhelming when you hear this. Yeah.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 51:09
I don’t have it.

Lisa King, RPh 51:10
Yeah, what do I eat? You know, so I give you a step by step go to your pantry, remove anything that with a lemon seasoning, go to your refrigerator take out the orange juice, I’ve not had orange juice in years. Now the other thing that usually happens and this happened with me is when women are first diagnosed, they’re like, okay, I can’t eat all these foods, so I’m just not gonna eat anything. So I started eating only bread and water. I mean, I’ve talked to women who only eat rice. I mean so then you get on this crazy thing where Okay, I’m only eating bread and water now. There’s zero nutrients. So not only am I up all night going to the bathroom, I don’t have any protein in my diet. I don’t have any nutrients because I’m only having bread and water I’m completely exhausted.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 51:55

Lisa King, RPh 51:55
I’m very inflammatory now you know, a backed up because you I’m not having any fire, you know. So, you know, you have to find what you can eat as well. So I do offer suggestions there. Because otherwise you think oh my gosh, I can’t eat anything. So you don’t eat anything and then that’s not good for you either.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 52:15
Let me just clarify this once you are diagnosed with interstitial cystitis, you is not that you take a pill, it fixes you, you’re done, and then you go back to who you were.

Lisa King, RPh 52:25
It is a chronic condition. So I mean, I didn’t realize that at first. So when I was first diagnosed, I started with the interstitial cystitis diet. I was doing bladder installations, a lot of women will do bladder installations where they put the medication right into your body, into your bladder rather. And also now there’s a new drug called Elmiron, which women also will take, which will help heal the bladder lining. So those are kind of the Mainstays, a lot of the drugs for overactive bladder, they help a little bit but you’re you’re urinating so frequently that oftentimes, they really don’t help a lot. And then there are side effects like dry mouth constipation. There are drugs also. One of them is called hydroxyzine which will help with the mass sells amitriptyline, which is a super old school drug, it’s an anti depressant can help walk that pain. So there are different drugs that you can take. But it is something that’s chronic. So you need to keep that inflammation in your bladder down. And that was one thing I didn’t realize. When I was first diagnosed, I was 28 years old. So I started feeling better after took every time I’d go into a severe flare. It took me about two years to feel better. Oh my god. And so at the end of two years, I was like, Oh, I’m better now. I’m feeling better. So I started eating more foods that I wasn’t supposed to eat. I’m Italian. So I mean, all the foods that I was eating poorly, were just horrible, like, you know, you know, pasta with tomato sauce and spicy sausage and egg cream Robuchon and, you know, spicy cheeses, so the Are all no no foods. And then I was coming down with a cold so I was like, Okay, I’m going to take really high dose vitamin C. Yeah, bad idea. So with that I wound up like kind of burning bladder, my bladder lining with vitamin C and kind of went into another really bad flare. That’s when I finally started doing the healing meditation at that point, and from there on I have been able to move forward and not look back with that said, I tell all the ladies I work with I treat my bladder like it’s precious gold. I mean, I still somewhat stick to the icy diet. You know, I have some foods here and there that are not recommended but not in abundance. And a lot of women will say, well once your bladders healed you can go back to eating those I personally don’t. And even some foods are triggers for me. That may not be triggers for other people like for me avocados are high in histamine so they would trigger the mast cells in my bladder and cause a flare for other women. May be fine for me Chinese food was not a good thing because the soy sauce is very high in sodium. And a lot of women don’t realize that when you have that bladder ulceration, when you have foods that are high in sodium, it’s like literally like putting salt on a wound. So they’re literally going to guess it literally is so even when you buy chicken in the store, it’s it’s soaked in a soft solution, the ones that you get in the the crab, not the one that you get the butcher so a lot of women will even find that chicken is a flair for them because you’re thinking oh, this is a healthy protein, but there’s so much sodium in it. So you have to look at even foods that are low in sodium. So it really becomes this really big dance with food when you have IC. So it is definitely something to look at. It’s not that if you were to only eat the proper foods, your IC would be cured but it would it definitely helps. But there’s just a synergy of a lot of different things. When I was first diagnosed pelvic floor physical therapy was not even really known; nowadays, it’s often recommended. So women who have IC have a very tight bladder floor. So just like when you have a bad back, when you keep your back so stiff, it makes your back feel even worse. Same thing with women who have IC, they’re holding their pelvic floor too tight. So they help relax that pelvic floor through for physical therapy.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 56:22
Yeah. And they’re experts now. We will have somebody’s talking about it in about the future very soon, very soon.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 56:30
So I want to ask a question because this, I think, related to this, why do you recommend on your teachings and courses to include mindset and lifestyle changes? When talking about you urinary track is this is depression is a weight thing is, is everything related? It’s all part of it.

Lisa King, RPh 56:49
I just really believe in body, mind and spirit. And so you really and I’m also a life coach. I have a life coach allocation. Yes. And so for me, it’s all about moving forward. Word towards healing. So even though it’s a slow process, you don’t ever want to go backwards. So you want to speak positively over your health. So for me, affirmations keep me moving forward. So you have to choose affirmations that you believe. But even if you’re saying to yourself, not I am healed my bladder, I am better because you might not believe that you may have say something like, I have all the tools in place that will eventually heal my bladder. I know I am moving forward towards bladder healing. I have the professionals supporting me who can heal my bladder.

Lisa King, RPh 57:36
So it just helps you move forward. And I’m just always about whether you know for yourself on crutches or women who have a painful bladder or someone who’s been diagnosed with heart disease, you have to just keep moving forward. You don’t want to move into the past what happened before happened. But now you’re moving forward towards healing and I feel like you have to keep that in the forefront of your mind in order to actually get go ahead and heal your body and create. What I would like to say is create an environment of healing in your body.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 58:05
Yeah. And one thing that is important also to mention this is that 20 years ago, none of this was study and research unknown, the way that it’s now. 20 years ago. Most of the stuff that is out, as you said, whether it’s for research or studies or because the internet people have communicated with each other, and it’s easier to handle, this was not the thing. So whoever’s been with it for over 20 years and said, I’ve tried everything, nothing works. Give it another chance, give another chance with new stuff, give it another chance with a holistic or whole, some approach, which is no choose let’s just take this pain pill that is going to fix it because it is not going to be fixed. It’s something that you’re going to live with for for the rest of your life. And you just need to learn how to handle it. And you can live a healthy happy life like Lisa does. So I believe that people like you that have Have a group that have a tribe of females that in this case are having the same issue that listen to each other that get the support from each other and truly understand; because maybe their husbands are not knowledgeable, they don’t get it, or the family or the mom. And as you saw, pathetic, you’d always are in trouble and you’re like, you don’t get it. And that’s okay. You just find people that do and that’s where you hang out. And that’s the people that you listen to. And that’s where you go ask questions and get the answers that you need, whether it is to refer to a new treatment or refer to a new doctor or a new specialist. But don’t isolate yourself because you tried 20 years ago, and it didn’t work because every, every day we get new stuff that helps everything.

Lisa King, RPh 59:46
Exactly and I often you know, on different interstitial cystitis podcasts that I’ve been on. I’ve talked about goal setting towards healing. And you know, just with any goal setting, you have to make a decision so you have to make that decision: I want to heal my body. One of the first things with any goal setting is to tell someone as an accountability partner. But with healing your bladder, a lot of times you may have to tell your family, look, you know, I am now really committed to healing my bladder. And this is going to mean that if I don’t feel up to it, I’m going to just sit on the couch after dinner, I’m not going to do the dishes. I’m going to meditate and possibly take a nap before the kids come home from school. Because my body needs to rest, I need to give it to the energy to heal. So let everyone know around you that this is really important to you and I may not be able to do what I did in the past, I may not be able to go go go, and I’m going to allow myself the time to heal because eventually I am going to heal or start feeling better. And then we can travel and I’m going to be able to do all these things with you that I haven’t been able to do in the past.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:00:50
Just give me a chance to heal! Yeah, exactly. And the families the best support and as a family member, if you’re listening to us and you have somebody that is telling you something like that, and you don’t understand it, it’s okay, which is respect their wishes. If she says, Hey, I cannot eat any lime or lemon related thing, don’t offer that to them is mean. And then you’re like, Oh, really are you just with that Hocus Pocus diet, even if it is for you if that is what you think it is, respect that for that person is not and, just don’t do it. If you want to drink it and get it out, do your thing because you are responsible for your life. But be supportive to the people that you love. Don’t make fun of them. Don’t push stuff that they’re not supposed to do or eat and, be mindful of what they feel because that is part of the healing process for that other person to become the best person that they could be to enjoy life with you.

Lisa King, RPh 1:01:49

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:01:50
Mm hmm. So tell me why did you become a life coach that is such a not pharmacy like mentality way to see life? So tell me about that.

Lisa King, RPh 1:02:00
I basically became a life coach after “I wrote tiny life changes” with my sisters. My sister is a life coach and she has this charity where she helps women all the time. So I just really felt like I don’t want to be posting about different things just from the experience that I had through. You know, I’ve always read so many different books, listen to podcasts, read different things. I want to have some background as to exactly what I’m doing. And so one of the things I learned as a life coach, it really is just about helping people move forward. So, you know, people still talk to me about you know, different things, but I’m always keeping them moving forward and helping them with their mindset. So that’s basically the reason I did it. So I kind of was a great marriage of being able to help women physically with their bladder issues and then also help them stay strong, as they are healing so I like being able to do both.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:02:54
Well, do you lady have pushed me a little bit more because I wanted to do it for a long time, but I’m like, No, we’re scientists. We’re not supposed to be doing that stuff. But I feel that, I will be a better pharmacist if I understand things from the life coach point of view, for my audience and my patients. So well, maybe I will get to it. They say, okay, universe, I live in to Lisa universe. I’m gonna get it done. Okay. So, Lisa, besides and Instagram, where else can people find you?

Lisa King, RPh 1:03:26
Well, I’m on Instagram and Facebook as @fulfilledpharmacist or you can reach me at my website, www.ditchbladderpain.com.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:03:34
I’m gonna put all those links there. So let’s say Lisa, that I am female that is been I’m urinated 35 times a day. And I counted because I thought it was too many. And I found out that Yeah, it is. And then I have when I walk because I like to walk in the mornings when it’s cool and nice. I feel that pain right there and it’s throbbing. So how can you help me How do I get to you for you, too. Tell me, this is in your head? Or maybe this is what you need to check. How do we start the connection?

Lisa King, RPh 1:04:07
Well, usually I’ll have a 20 minute consultation with women, and talk to them about their symptoms, give them some different tips about things that they can do different supplements that may use some of their bladder pain. And then if they want to work with me, they can join my course, which is a transformational course, it’s different ways to ditch bladder pain, there’s different mindset, lifestyle and dietary tips. And then I will usually work with them. Mostly on mindset. Most of the women that I work with really just want to talk to me as someone who has been through what they’ve been through, and I encourage them that they can really heal their body. So we just keep moving forward on different mindsets. So if they’re having a really hard time and saying, I just don’t know if I can get… if I can heal, and when that happens, I’ll maybe jump into one of these groups and I see all these Other women who aren’t healing, then we’ll work on something like well, what can you do? What is a goal that you want to do? What is something you want to do once your bladder heals? Do you want to take a year trip to Europe with your spouse, let’s start planning that out. Start whenever, those thoughts come about, let’s start planning that trip and keep that faith that you will get better. So I really, I know that the ladies I talked to always say I feel so much better after I talk to you. So I really just help them keep moving forward towards that healing, and have an understanding of the body that will create an environment of healing through nutrition through probiotics through different supplements. I’m not a big supplement person, but there are some things that can help. I also have a huge knowledge of their medications. So I’ve even helped people get prior authorizations on their drugs. They’re like, my, my doctor doesn’t know how to do this. What do I tell them? So, I mean, I really feel like I have that full approach and they are comforted by the fact that I did have a severely ulcerated bladder and here I am 17 years later, medication free and living the fulfilled life that I desire.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:06:06
You do. So tell me about how they could get to this course that you have that you offer,

Lisa King, RPh 1:06:14
through my website, ditch bladder pain, calm, they can get a 35 page free report. And there’s also a link in there in the report that tells a little bit more about the course. And they can follow that there and then sign up there if they would like.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:06:28
So I heard that you have a special going on, very soon. So what is that about?

Lisa King, RPh 1:06:35
Well, to be honest, I just really want to help as many women as I can and and along with your podcast. I have a lot of podcasts coming out in April and I am not working anymore. So I have more time to work with ladies.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:06:47
Hold on this is working too, Lady Excuse me!

Lisa King, RPh 1:06:51
I’m not in the pharmacy anymore. So I’m offering my course at $97 which I really you know, I feel like I want it to be accessible to people. And I’ve been told in the past, you know what this is changing people’s lives. You need to ask more money, but I really honestly just want to help women heal. So I’m, for the month of April, at least, I am giving the course for $97. And then we can work together through April. And if you want to work with me further, then we could talk about that afterwards.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:07:22
So it’s going to be legaldrugdealer.com/18, which is the episode number if you go there. That’s a web page that were dedicated to this episode with Lisa links with comments that she made with a couple of quotes that you can tweet actually a picture of her because you need to see how British it is. And then, of course, all the links to everything that you have referred to the books, the other podcast that she’s been on, and of course, her web page on her course. Anything else that you want to add?

Lisa King, RPh 1:07:51
Now I’m just thankful that I’m here and that I can spread the message because there’s so many women suffering silence, and I just don’t want them to be alone.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:07:58
Me neither. That’s why I’m here. You over and if you need to go with Lisa go please right ahead. IG is the best way, Instagram to @thefulfillpharmacists

Lisa King, RPh 1:08:07
I had honestly you know I I’m a pretty laid back person so I like I know there’s links where you can you know sign up for a little session with me on my on my course and through ditch splatter paint calm but just messaged me on Instagram. That’s the best way or if you’re not on Instagram, on Facebook.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:08:26
What do you think? It was very interesting, huh? And then a lot of information that I personally didn’t know about. Thank you so much, Lisa for educating us on this subject that is so important for females. And also for males to understand because you need to see and understand and and think about what females are going through so you understand your partner better.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:08:51
So, Lisa have prepared this discount for you guys. I invite you to take advantage of it. It is on her course. It is included on the links and the website, www.theLegaldrugdealer.com/18. And at the bottom of that page, you will see all the links and it will be there as well as Lisa’s Instagram account that she has so much information to give every day that you will love to follow her. I will also have her Facebook information and all the references that she mentioned including the book that she co wrote with her sister. I truly hope that you get a lot from this.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:09:30
So that’s it for this episode. Thank you so much for listening, please subscribe to the podcast give us a review reviews are very important so that way people would know that we do a good job here. So then they will be motivated to listen… So please, please please write us a review. Also if you have any questions, please send them to me at comment@ theLegalDrugdealer.com and I will be happy to respond to you directly. Please visit our website and look around and see what they have there for you mainly datang the corona virus and of course, that episode for today that is number 18. So you just have to go to theLegaldrugdealer.com/18 and then find out more details about this episode. Next week I will be talking to you about vaccinations, but I won’t be alone. Somebody that you already know is coming back. Her name is Angela Solis, a pharmacist from Austin, Texas, and she is an expert in this area. She has a lot of experience with vaccinations and she’s going to tell us all about it. I do not want any controversy on this episode. I just want you guys to know what a pharmacist have to say, in regards to vaccinations. If you have any questions or you have your standpoint, I will respect them but you also need to respect ours.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:10:52
Well, that’s it for today. I am done before I go. And just in case no one has told you today I wanted to take a minute to remind you of how awesome you are. And how lucky are those that have you in their lives. Thank you for being the awesome you that you are. Have a wonderful rest of your day.

Marilena Grittani, RPh 1:11:13
This is Marilena Grittani, The Legal Drug Dealer. Bye for now.


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